At my wits end with this crank trigger - the saga continues!!

[Valver.]

I'm using 1.0.53 with Megatune 2.25, with the following primary trigger settings (the car has run with this exact setup, but the spark was relatively weak):

Edge: Rising
Type: Multitooth
Filtering: Disabled
Advanced filtering: Disabled
Special N-1: Disabled
Fiat Stilo: Disabled
TDC after trigger: 60
Number of teeth on wheel: 58
Trigger tooth: 3
Next trigger tooth: 30
Crank min period: 3744 usec
Angular width of tooth: 2
Tooth relation Normal: 122 (irrelevant with multitooth advanced filter disabled)
Tooth relation Missing: 181 (irrelevant with multitooth advanced filter disabled)
Angular width of missing teeth: 6
Engine phase: 240

It's also worth pointing out that when I first got my new ECU back, it came with 1.0.73 and the RPM signal counted fine but there was no spark or fuel coming through. I don't understand all the config files, so I reloaded the 1.0.53 firmware, which counted RPM ok for a while, but then it became intermittent very quickly. When it counts, I have spark, an the injectors are firing fine.

I think I'll just reinstall the distributor and use that for the primary trigger: The previous owner of the ECU said he doesn't have a tested config file for this setup, though, and I have no idea how to write one... 

[Valver.]

Is it worth checking my board is soldered correctly for my setup as described here on the Wiki?

v3.3 (trig1) primary trigger=HALL

solder JP2 & JP7: this is the top right of the 2x3 header; red on the [image]. The same area of v3.3 looks slightly different (no bottom-right pad, where the blue jumper sits on the image), but never mind. The primary trigger is the same, the changes are at the secondary trigger, eg. 1 throughole pin dropped, and R48 moved to bottom.
short SJ2
do NOT short SJ6 (remove the blob if there)
R30=2k7 pullup resistor (2k .. 4.7k). Note that 10k is a bit too high
remove R56(=18k, next to SJ2). This is not necessary if R30 is 4k7 or lower.
measure DC voltage between SJ2 and GND (with board powered, but HALL sensor not connected or inactive): must be higher than 3V

If I take a photo of the board, could someone confirm it is setup properly?

[Valver.]

I've just probed the primary trigger pin at the VEMS to check the crank sensor whilst turning the engine over slowly by hand: it's moving from 3.5V down to 0.05V at each tooth consistently, so I assume this is fine aswell.

If I change the 'Primary trigger' option at the top of the primary trigger table in Megatune from number '1' to any other number, thus setting it to 'coil-type' ignition (as I understand it anyway), and disconnect the injectors and coil, the car will count RPM consistently, but the readings are obviously jumping around and are very high. In any case, though, the VEMS is getting a signal.

So, in short, I have a good crank signal consistently, but intermittent RPM readings from the VEMS when it is correctly set to a multitooth trigger.

There must surely be something wrong with the configuration of the ECU or the maps?!

There is no one in my country that knows anything about this ECU which makes things even harder. All our local ECUs (Autronic, Motec, Wolf3d etc) don't need modifications to the board or configs drawn up to suit individual setups, so no one (myself included) understands how to do any of this!! And, what's more, the configuration or soldering of the board is about all that's left to be affecting my car

Does anyone else have any more ideas before I throw it in the bin?    We have tried for months to get it to work and I am now out of patience

[Bat]

Hi,
I'd upload 1.0.73 into the ECU then reconfigure the H tables (I think)
They're basically the inj? and coil firing orders, the notation changed after .53.
There's a post on here about how to do the changes
http://www.vems.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=120.0
Cheers,
Gavin

[Valver.]

Thanks Gavin,

I'm not entirely sure about editing the tables.txt files so they work, though... when my ECU first came back with 1.0.73, I had no spark or fuel...?!

I am terribly bad with computers, which is making this DIY upgrade stuff so much harder 

[Bat]

Hi,
You can edit the h tables in MT so no problem there. Just download you current tables then upgrade to .73 and upload your tables. Then edit the injector outputs and ignition outputs in the settings menu in MT. I think the description in that post covers it
Cheers,
Gavin

[Valver.]

Well, that didn't go too well... Now my firmware has gone haywire and neither 1.0.73, nor 1.0.53 will upload.

Whenever I go to generateconfig.bat, I get a 'no hello from AVR message', the same thing when I try to upload either firmware 

When I first uploaded the 1.0.53 again, I skipped the steps of generate and downloadconfig.bat, so I'm sure this can't have helped either. I just don't understand this stuff, but am beginning to realise that this has to be firmware problem as all the mechanical and electrical side of things is fine (as is the crank wave signal on the oscilliscope).

How the hell do I make this work now... now my VEMS powers up fine and gives the 1.0.53 firmware message, but the LCD goes mad after that and shows its readings in repeated rows (the RPM line runs repeatedly down the screen for example) . The controller code doesn't match the Megatune software now either, so I also can't connect properly to that.

I have obviously further corrupted the firmware, but how do I fix it now? This whole process makes me feel very old and technologically stupid.

I do have copies of the following tables:

Config:



primep=0A

primep_temp_scaling=00

cwl=46

cwh=10

cranking_thres=03

awev=14

awev_temp_scaling=0A

awec=2A

warmup_clt_range[0]=00

warmup_clt_range[1]=10

warmup_clt_range[2]=24

warmup_clt_range[3]=38

warmup_clt_range[4]=50

warmup_clt_range[5]=64

warmup_clt_range[6]=78

warmup_clt_range[7]=8C

warmup_clt_range[8]=AA

warmup_clt_range[9]=C8

warmup_clt[0]=8C

warmup_clt[1]=8C

warmup_clt[2]=8C

warmup_clt[3]=82

warmup_clt[4]=7F

warmup_clt[5]=7B

warmup_clt[6]=77

warmup_clt[7]=72

warmup_clt[8]=6D

warmup_clt[9]=64

warmup_rpm_scale=CC

req_fuel=50

divider=01

alternate=13

injopen=00

battfac=13

kpafac=96

kpaoffs=80

injocfuel=2A

injrampup_battfac=FF

injpwm=FF

injpwmt=0A

als_launch_input=0F

rpmk[0]=0B

rpmk[1]=B8

tpsdot_kpadot_conf=00

tpsdotrate[0]=03

tpsdotrate[1]=0A

tpsdotrate[2]=14

tpsdotrate[3]=1E

tpsaq[0]=00

tpsaq[1]=0A

tpsaq[2]=14

tpsaq[3]=1E

als_cut_mintps=3B

tpsasync=06

acmult=8C

tpsacold=28

launch_enrich=33

launch_retard=60

overrun_fuelcut=64

overrun_fuelresume=64

rev_limit=4E

airden_ignore=00

config11=31

config12=40

config13=02

batt_cal=BC

fastidle=FC

als_max_cut=00

dbaro=0C

tps_low=00

tps_high=FF

fan_temp=5F

fan_hyst=05

fan_channel=FF

iac_step_seq=C9

iac_conf=58

iac_max_steps=FF

iac_tps_thres=1A

iac_cold_idle_temp=7E

iac_warm_idle_temp=C6

iac_cold_rpm=78

iac_warm_rpm=50

iac_cold_start_pos=B3

iac_warm_start_pos=4D

iac_afterstart_rpm=0A

iac_afterstart_duration=00

iac_speed=04

iac_kp=14

iac_ki=0A

iac_kd=0A

launch_rpm=64

iac_integral_limit_dec=32

iac_integral_limit_inc=32

iac_integral_deadband=14

iac_deadband=1E

als_cut_maxtps=80

iac_overclose_interval=80

iac_ref_pos[0]=FF

iac_ref_pos[1]=FF

iac_ref_pos[2]=F2

iac_ref_pos[3]=E6

iac_ref_pos[4]=D9

iac_ref_pos[5]=CC

iac_ref_pos[6]=B3

iac_ref_pos[7]=A6

iac_ref_pos[8]=99

iac_ref_pos[9]=8C

iac_sol_channel=70

iac_ign_slope=28

softrpm_range=4B

iac_ign_advance_limit=20

iac_ign_retard_limit=20

iac_ign_threshold=08

ego_conf=06

ego_lag=01

ego_coolant=B4

ego_maxtps=E6

ego_maxmap=00

ego_minrpm=06

ego_maxrpm=49

ego_warmup=3C

ego_lean_limit=00

ego_rich_limit=00

ego_pid_kp=28

als_enrich=1A

ego_delta=00

ego_target=19

ego_pid_window=FF

wbo2_warmup_ramp=A0

als_react_tps=99

wbo2_abs_limit=E4

wbo2_limit_maxt=A0

wbo2_fallback=B0

wbo2_retry_t=06

wbo2_edgetime_corr=BA

wbo2_edgetime_min=50

wbo2_ri_target=96

wbo2_nernstdc_target=85

wbo2_pump_pw_zero=68

wbo2_calibration=A8

wbo2_heater_pid_kp=46

wbo2_heater_pid_ki=10

wbo2_heater_pid_kd=1A

wbo2_heater_pid_ilimit=80

wbo2_pump_pid_kp=15

wbo2_pump_pid_ki=4E

wbo2_pump_pid_kd=00

wbo2_pump_pid_ilimit=84

wbo2_ri_confidence_scale=80

knock_conf=00

knock_sampling_window=28

knock1_frequency=29

knock1_gain=00

knock1_integrator=0F

knock2_frequency=29

knock2_gain=00

knock2_integrator=0F

knock_threshold=FF

knock_noise_scale=FF

knock_max_retard=00

knock_default_retard=00

knock_retard_step=00

knock_retard_delay=00

knock_advance_step=00

knock_advance_delay=00

knock_minrpm=FF

knock_maxrpm=FF

ve_learn_coolant=D8

ve_learn_max_power=FF

ve_learn_rpm_scale=1E

ve_learn_kpa_scale=1E

ve_learn_ego_scale=43

ve_learn_min_weight=4D

ve_learn_speed=FF

ve_learn_limit=33

ve_learn_conf=00

lcd_c0=FF

lcd_delay=FF

lcd_backlight=FF

kpa_conf=22

ign_balance=50

als_retard_mintps=3B

als_retard_maxtps=80

lcd_default_view=00

primary_trigger=01

secondary_trigger=02

tooth_wheel=3A

trigger_tooth=03

another_trigger_tooth=1E

crank_minper=EA

tooth_wheel_twidth1=02

tooth_wheel_twidth2=06

cam_sync_r_edge_phase=01

cam_sync_f_edge_phase=02

reset_engphase_after=F0

ign_tdcdelay=78

ign_dwell14=1F

ign_dwell6=38

ign_crank_advance=14

ign_out=70

ignchmax=03

engine_off_delay=0F

pump_on_mintime=0B

fuelpump_channel=57

inj_stage2_rate=FF

inj_stage2_start_tps=FF

inj_stage2_start_map=00

als_deact_rpm=0A

als_deact_time=05

als_deact_egt=00

als_retard=F0

als_rev_limit=64

misc1out_minrpm=01

misc1out_maxrpm=FF

misc1out_mintps=FF

misc1out_maxtps=FF

misc1out_minmap=00

misc1out_maxmap=00

misc1out_channel=FF

misc2out_minrpm=FF

misc2out_maxrpm=FF

misc2out_mintps=FF

misc2out_maxtps=FF

misc2out_minmap=00

misc2out_maxmap=00

misc2out_channel=FF

act_wot_rpm=FF

act_wot_channel=FF

act_rpm_rpm=FF

act_rpm_channel=FF

egt1_cal=47

als_tks_channel=FF

boost_conf=00

boost_targetoffs=00

boost_minpressure=80

boost_pid_kp=20

boost_pid_ki=80

boost_pid_kd=01

boost_pid_ilimit=FF

boost_channel=FF

water_pump_temp=00

hybrid_rpm_a=00

hybrid_rpm_m=00

water_pump_hyst=00

water_pump_channel=FF

toothrel_normal=7A

toothrel_missing=B5

fuelcut_min_kpa=0A

fuelcut_max_kpa=7D

tach_channel=07

tach_div=10

shiftcut_conf=01

shiftcut_channel=FF

shiftcut_time=00

softrpm_rpm=4B

Tables:


j[0]=6580 6580 6580 6680 6780 6880 6980 6980 6B80 6980 6280 5B80
j[1]=6480 5D80 5B80 5F80 6580 6880 6980 6880 6C80 6D80 6780 5E80
j[2]=6380 5B80 5980 5E80 6380 6780 6980 6880 6D80 6D80 6980 6180
j[3]=6380 5980 5680 5980 6180 6480 6680 6680 6B80 6F80 6B80 6380
j[4]=6380 5980 5880 5880 5F80 6280 6580 6580 6A80 6F80 6D80 6480
j[5]=6480 5F80 5A80 5A80 5E80 6180 6380 6580 6A80 6F80 6E80 6780
j[6]=5F80 5F80 5C80 5B80 6080 6380 6480 6780 6B80 7180 7080 6980
j[7]=6580 6280 5C80 5C80 6080 6480 6880 6C80 7380 7680 7580 6C80
j[8]=6F80 6B80 6880 6380 6380 6780 6B80 6F80 7780 7A80 7980 7080
j[9]=7880 7680 6E80 6A80 6880 6B80 7080 7680 7C80 8080 8080 7880
j[A]=8580 8380 7F80 7B80 7A80 7D80 8180 8680 8B80 8E80 8C80 8480
j=8E80 8D80 8B80 8880 8780 8A80 8D80 8E80 9380 9680 9580 8F80
l[0]=3D 36 2F 2F 2F 2F 2F 2F 2F 2F 2F 2F
l[1]=37 34 31 31 31 31 31 31 31 31 31 31
l[2]=37 36 31 31 31 31 31 31 31 31 31 31
l[3]=37 37 37 37 37 37 37 37 37 37 37 37
l[4]=37 37 43 47 4F 4F 4F 4F 4F 4F 4F 4F
l[5]=47 47 4F 55 58 58 58 58 58 58 58 58
l[6]=66 66 66 66 66 66 66 66 66 66 66 66
l[7]=6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B
l[8]=6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B
l[9]=6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B
l[A]=6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B
l=6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B 6B
n[0]=D0 08 08 30 68 A0 BC BC BC C0 C0 C4
n[1]=40 08 08 34 68 98 BC BC BC C0 C0 C4
n[2]=40 08 08 38 70 94 BC BC BC C0 C0 C4
n[3]=40 14 14 40 78 94 A8 B0 B0 B8 B8 C0
n[4]=40 1C 1C 4C 7C 94 94 A0 9F A8 B0 B8
n[5]=2C 2B 2B 4C 78 8C 94 88 88 90 94 9C
n[6]=2C 38 38 48 70 74 78 70 70 78 7C 7C
n[7]=2C 38 38 44 68 6C 70 68 68 70 74 74
n[8]=2C 38 38 3B 54 58 5C 54 53 5C 60 64
n[9]=2C 30 30 34 48 48 4C 48 44 48 4C 54
n[A]=2C 30 30 2B 30 30 30 28 28 2C 30 30
n=2C 1C 1C 18 10 10 0C 08 08 0C 10 10
k[0]=0A 0F 14 1C 22 28 2B 3C 4B 5F 78 96
r[0]=07 08 0C 11 18 1E 23 28 32 3C 46 52
h[0]=02 08 10 41 00 00 00 80
h[1]=00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
h[2]=01 02 01 02 04 05 06 07
b[0]=14 18 1C 20 24 28 2C 30 80 80 80 80
t[0]=21 40 60 80 A0 C0 E0 FF


Hopefully these aren't now corrupted aswell

[Valver.]

I've just remembered something and I now believe I may know the problem:

When we first connected up the VEMS, the car ran, but the pins in the ECU plugs were very worn and barely connecting, so we found that pressing them against the unit would keep the engine running (we have now repinned the both plugs, though).

HOWEVER: Prior to replacing the pins, I connected the VEMS to the laptop in attempt to find the problems, BUT, I was using the Megasquirt version of the software (as I understood it was the same - yes I am stupid, I know). An error message came up saying the controller and VEMS codes didn't match, that it was "usually a very serious problem; table corruption may occur", silly me proceeded ON A NUMBER of occasions and, until now, I haven't twigged that after that, the car has never run - the RPM signal has been intermittent or nonexistent the whole time. It was a bit iffy before, but I am certain this was only because the pins were terribly connected.

So... what do I do now, have I completely stuffed everything?! If any of you very cluey people can help, I'm more than willing to PayPal you some money for proper assistance in getting it fixed (if this is even possible!!) - it's certainly cheaper than buying a new ECU.

Does this all make sense and would it fit with the problems I've been having?

Thankyou again - you're all very helpful And sorry for my stupidity. I am 64 and just don't understand much of anything that doesn't have carbs 

[GintsK]

If firmware corrupted, it is possible to switch VEMS in special bootloader mode: shorten pins 2 and 3 on 9pin female connector and then switch on ignition and attach serial cable. Beside you must change -wtE to -wE inside upload-firmware12x12.bat or upload-firmware.bat whatever used for sending firmware to VEMS. (right click on file -> edit. edit ->file->save). And then send firmware using this file.

Another method here: http://www.vems.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=209.0

And every time use only Megtatune for given firmware! It is important!
You can find package here: http://www.vems.hu/wiki/index.php?page=MegaTune

Gints

[Bat]

Hi,
You're not alone with this, I'm one for not reading the instructions throughly and usually have to spend hours putting something right, just to get back to the beggining  
Try this for size... http://www.vems.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=209.0
I've not had any firmware issues so that topic is the best help I can offer, however there's 2 or 3 successful outcomes reported
As posted above always use the MT that comes with the firmware package you uploaded into the ECU, that error message is telling you they don't match, even though it doesn't say as much!
Personally I would now upload 1.0.73final firmware as this seems to be the best offering at the moment
Cheers,
Gavin

[Valver.]

Thanks I've tried uploading the 1.0.73 (and the .53), but I now keep getting a "no hello from AVR" message.

I'm assuming that if I try to upload after performing the modification to the serial cable that it will be ok, though?

Can someone tell me, though, whether my using of the wrong Megatune has corrupted my tables, though, and is this potential my RPM signal problem??

In any case, I'll again to upload the firmware and report back  (where do I find the pin-outs for the serial cable, so I know which ones to bridge, though?)

[GintsK]

Because of "no hallo from AVR" you need this special mode.
For some reason this is common situation. At least for me. May be my USB-serial adapter is cause.

Pin numbers is on connector. Magnifying glass can be needed.

Or ask goolgle for DB9 pinout:


Another thing:
On 1.0.73  I use Angular width of tooth = 120  and 240 for missing teeth. It is unintelligible values copied from someones configurations for 60-2. On newer 1.1.x firmwares it is clearer - [degrees*4].

Gints

[Bat]

Hi,
I don't know if it could be the cause of the RPM problem, but as you stand at the moment you need to get the ECU up and running so go with the serial port bridging then get your firmware and tables uploaded
By bridging the 2 pins on the serial port you are taking the ECU into the bootloader sequence, which is what the factory use to clear the ECU and upload the initial firmware.
The only way you'll be able to tell if the tables have been corrupted is to upload them into the ECU and see if they work, as far as I know....
Cheers,
Gavin

[Valver.]

Hi all,

Good news so far: I managed to get the 1.0.73 back on and the RPM signal has returned, but my fuel and spark have gone again. I'm assuming my setup doesn't suit the new firmware.

I have absolutely no idea how to check and/or edit the configuration where applicable, can someone please provide me with an idiots guide to doing so... or is there anything I can post up here that will help you all out any further?

Thanks again to all who continue to offer assistance - we are hugely grateful to you 

[rob@vems.co.uk]

on 1.0.53 to 1.0.73 they made a change so that the stepper motor could easily be used to drive the igniter packs, so they moved the h[2] thing around a bit, you need to change the value in tables.txt:
h[2]=01 02 01 02 04 05 06 07
to
h[2]=10 20 10 20 10 20 10 20 (repeating the same number pattern is said to be a good thing to do - why?  Who knows?)

If you then save the file and use generate-config12x12WithDefaults.bat the program will pull in all the other configlet files so ensure that the WBO2 settings are correct and that the new ALS is turned off.

This should return your spark - as for why fuel has gone... thats something I'm not sure about, lets get the spark back first then do the other bits next.